Sailing has potential to be... (OSRS)
| Date | 2025-04-02 |
| Type | news-opinion |
| Video | youtu.be/hfrGzE8rGj0 |
Summary
After Sailing Alpha #1, Gnomonkey reviews the skill's training methods (port tasks, salvaging, sea charting, Barracuda Trials) and argues Sailing needs more engaging methods than 'Fishing 2' at launch. He proposes procedurally generated voyages with ship-equipment mechanics, explains what makes content feel minigame-like, and urges players to give specific feedback to the developers.
Outline
- 0:00 Introduction: Sailing has merit; Alpha #1 recap
- 0:28 Alpha training methods: port tasks, salvaging, sea charting
- 1:59 Barracuda Trials as Sepulchre in the ocean
- 2:57 Methods not shown in the alpha (sea hunter, mini raid)
- 3:58 Gnomonkey's procedural voyage idea and exploration
- 5:24 Jimmy's video and the Reddit reaction
- 7:51 Skilling crowd versus engagement crowd; 'doesn't feel old school'
- 9:09 What makes content minigame-like, using Dungeoneering as example
- 11:50 RS3 Divination as 'more of the same' skilling
- 14:54 Why Dungeoneering felt repetitive; Wind Waker islands as inspiration
- 17:23 Ship equipment idea: auto drill, chainsaw, cannon, storage
- 21:21 Sailing should be held to a higher standard; give constructive feedback
- 23:58 Sailing must launch fleshed out, not as 'Forestry part two'
- 25:44 Overall takeaway and hopes for further alphas
Topics covered
Sailing
- (0:00) Gnomonkey says he does not think Sailing has no merit or promise; he sees a lot of merit and a lot the developers could do to make it really good.
- (0:28) The Sailing alpha showed the rough training methods but was missing combat and several methods.
- (3:27) Jagex said a couple more Sailing methods would come later in a 'Forestry part two' way, including a Slayer and Hunter combination of hunting leviathans, which has been confirmed not to be in the release, and a mini raid that also will not be in the release.
- (3:57) Gnomonkey says he is very impressed with the Sailing alpha, that the core boat mechanics feel okay, and that the skill has a long way to go.
- (22:27) Gnomonkey likes some Sailing systems such as ship turning, the speed boost from hitting the sails, and the speed boost from water whirlpools, but says the way you train the skill is just not it.
- (22:58) Gnomonkey says that whether you want Sailing or not, it is coming because it has passed the poll, so the best thing to do is look for ways to improve it.
- (23:58) Gnomonkey says Sailing must come out fleshed out rather than being fixed 6 to 12 months later with a 'Sailing part two', as Forestry kept having issue after issue and never got there.
- (24:24) Gnomonkey warns that if Sailing launches with uninteresting training methods after day-one hype, Jagex will lose a huge chunk of the people who were on board, even if procedural voyages, mini raids and hunter-slayer methods come later.
- (26:44) Gnomonkey says Sailing will not feel like Old School RuneScape when it releases and that this is okay, because if it felt old school nobody would be excited about it.
- (26:45) Gnomonkey says he does not want Sailing to repeat the mistake many RS3 skills made of simply not being good.
- (26:46) Gnomonkey would like to see more alphas including one showing Sailing combat, which was completely missing from the first alpha.
Sailing
- (0:28) Port tasks in the Sailing alpha are cargo missions (sail from point A to B delivering cargo) or killing a number of sailing creatures such as sharks and manta rays, which Gnomonkey calls basic Sailing Slayer plus cargo missions.
- (1:00) Gnomonkey compares port tasks to the bread-and-butter Motherlode Mine of Sailing: not super high intensity but not AFK either.
- (1:00) Shipwreck salvaging means going to a salvage spot, clicking your hook and pulling up salvage that can be turned in for loot, which Gnomonkey says is just like mining or woodcutting.
- (1:29) Gnomonkey says a player called HeBox found two-tick salvaging in the alpha, using a three-tick action with two rolls, possibly giving the best Sailing XP rates and being the overall meta.
- (1:59) Sea charting gives one-time XP on reaching a new area and is aimed at completionists and cloggers, so it is not really a training method.
- (2:16) Barracuda Trials are described as Hallowed Sepulchre in the ocean: you sail around collecting supplies and try to return quickly without letting your ship get too damaged, and Gnomonkey says it is theoretically the best XP method.
- (2:28) Gnomonkey says Barracuda Trials looked janky, was the thing he was most excited for, and he does not see it reaching Sepulchre-level engagement unless it is improved, though plugins could add indicators or routes.
- (3:27) Gnomonkey summarises the alpha methods as cargo missions with Slayer-like tasks, Woodcutting 2 (salvaging) and a janky Sepulchre.
- (21:21) Gnomonkey says he has no issue with any of the alpha methods individually and does not mind slow AFK methods like salvaging existing, but wants them not to be the only or primary way to train.
Opinion: Procedural voyages for Sailing
- (3:58) Gnomonkey proposes procedural voyages where you (solo or with friends) sail to a voyage tier you have access to, beyond the map edge, where a chunk of map with islands, resources, activities and monsters is procedurally generated, ending in a big main objective such as a boss in a volcano island dungeon.
- (4:52) Gnomonkey says he spent more time in the alpha randomly sailing around, using detached camera to look at islands, than training, and considers exploration the most engaging part of Sailing.
- (5:24) Gnomonkey says YouTuber Jimmy had the same take and experience, noting exploration of an island can only be done once, and Jimmy also suggested procedural voyages.
- (14:54) Gnomonkey says Wind Waker's islands each have something unique (a cannon fortress, a hollow giant tree, a volcano to cool, an ice-breathing dragon to heat), and procedural voyages could have 10 to 20 distinct main island varieties to avoid being samey.
- (17:23) Gnomonkey suggests voyages list the resources you can find (ores, trees, hunter creatures) and ships have equipment slots, so you can drop an auto drill or ship chainsaw to harvest ore or logs while you explore and return to some resources and a small chunk of XP.
- (17:23) Gnomonkey suggests the ship equipment could give only small XP chunks (for example 2k Woodcutting or 3k Mining) as a bonus, not the primary training method, and could also include a cannon that blows a hole in an island to access a dungeon, or a storage chest for extra potions.
- (19:51) Gnomonkey says voyages should not be separate from the game world, and players should bring their own supplies and haul back loot such as treasure, oars, logs and fish, because a self-contained supply system feels like a minigame.
- (20:19) Gnomonkey pictures dark corners of the new Sailing map labelled with level requirements and themes, such as a fiery 'Volcanic Fissure' voyage, with different level brackets.
- (21:21) Gnomonkey says he does not want procedural voyages to be like Dungeoneering, where you are stripped of items and make everything from scratch.
Opinion: Minigames versus skills
- (7:51) Gnomonkey says 'doesn't feel old school' is meaningless and not constructive, usually meaning the animations or gameplay look janky or private-server-like, i.e. 'I don't like this content'.
- (8:09) Gnomonkey breaks down what makes something 'minigamey': done primarily in one location, reward currency (such as Gotr points or Motherlode Mine gold nuggets), a unique UI overlay, completable unlocks, feeling separate from the game world, and a timer or win/lose condition.
- (8:50) Gnomonkey says Reddit wants Sailing to be many times more engaging than any existing skill but also not minigame-like, and says you cannot please every crowd.
- (9:09) Gnomonkey says avoiding those traits is a good way to avoid minigame-ness.
- (26:44) Gnomonkey says it is equally unhelpful to turn down an idea just because it sounds like a minigame, as not everything is a minigame.
Opinion: Sailing and the skilling crowd
- (6:19) Gnomonkey says some players, who love basic skilling and would welcome a 'Crafting 2', are fine with exactly what the alpha proposes and just want more of the same skilling.
- (7:20) Gnomonkey says he has a max cape and has done more skilling on an alt than he believes 95% of Reddit users, but does not inherently enjoy clicking a tree and banking logs.
- (21:21) Gnomonkey says some replies claiming Sailing is fine because 'Firemaking has no engagement' miss the point: Sailing is not Firemaking 2 or Fishing 2, and as the newest skill after many years it should be held to a higher standard.
- (21:21) Gnomonkey notes Jagex has worked on Sailing for over a year, and says that if it were Firemaking 2, a lot of people would be upset.
- (26:44) Gnomonkey urges players who dislike aspects of Sailing to explain exactly what they dislike, and to join the Sailing Discord where developers listen, since it mostly contains people who already like Sailing.
Dungeoneering
- (9:09) Gnomonkey describes Dungeoneering in RS3 as done in a non-Wilderness corner called Daemonheim, with random dungeon floors that give XP, level-ups and new floors up to level 120, and tokens to buy rewards.
- (9:09) Gnomonkey says he actually likes Dungeoneering a lot but thinks it has many issues, and that it felt minigamey because it separates you from the game world, strips your items and makes you craft your own gear from scratch.
- (14:51) Gnomonkey says Dungeoneering felt repetitive because it is all done in the same location, floor themes are mostly colour palette swaps, and you restart from the first floors repeatedly.
Divination
- (11:50) Gnomonkey describes RS3 Divination as a gathering skill where you poke rifts with wisps and AFK harvest energy used in Invention.
- (12:17) Gnomonkey lists Divination XP rates: about 5k XP an hour at levels 1 to 10 west of Lumbridge crater, 10k at 10 to 20 near Falador lodestone, 12k at 20 to 30 near Varrock lodestone, 19k at 30 to 40 at Seers' Village, and 23k at 40 to 50 at the Fremennik Slayer Dungeon.
- (12:50) Gnomonkey uses Divination as an example of 'Fishing 2' skilling that he does not want Sailing to be: go somewhere, AFK, then move to a better spot for slightly more XP with no engagement.
- (13:23) Gnomonkey says OSRS does not need a Fishing 2 because it takes thousands of hours to get a max cape and there is plenty of the same stuff already.